Friday, October 29, 2010

Re: Tea party antics could end up burning Republicans


ROTFLMAO!
Now you are going to appeal to authority as though MORE fallacy will support your absurdities?

If the drafters of the Constitution MEANT "Citizen" they would have used the word "Citizen" just as they did where it was warranted.

Regard$,
--MJ

Today, when a concerted effort is made to obliterate this point, it cannot be repeated too often that the Constitution is a limitation on the government, not on private individuals -- that it does not prescribe the conduct of private individuals, only the conduct of the government -- that it is not a charter _for_ government power, but a charter of the citizen's protection _against_ the government. -- Alyssa Rosenbaum



At 01:53 PM 10/29/2010, you wrote:
That is one convoluted, and I might add, WRONG interpretation Michael.  "The People"  mean the Citizens of the United States.   Not illegals, not, "The People of France", etc., etc., etc....Numerous case law citations on this very premise, again, I'll come back to it maybe tonight.
 
Keith
 


 
On Fri, Oct 29, 2010 at 1:41 PM, MJ <michaelj@america.net> wrote:

Article III deals with the JUDICIARY.

There you go again with that silliness about 'illegals'.
Citizens relate (re: US Constitution) SPECIFICALLY as denoted.

Items like -- for example -- Amendment  IV (for simplicity)

  The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses,
  papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures,
  shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon
  probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly
  describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to
  be seized.
restrict the GOVERNMENT from action against PEOPLE -- regardless of
whether they are Citizens, Visitors, have the Government's unconstitutional
permission, etc.  It plainly LIMITS the Feds from doing as stated.

Naturalization (or naturalisation), of course, is the acquisition of
citizenship and nationality by somebody who was not a citizen or
national of that country when he or she was born.
Naturalization has NOTHING to do with entering/exiting.

There was no claim that Citizens were something else.

Regard$,
--MJ

I was about to say that I'd hate to live in a country
where the law could mean whatever its rulers said
it meant, when it occurred to me that I already do.
-- Joseph Sobran




At 01:28 PM 10/29/2010, you wrote:
Art. III referenced the Constitution and treaties, but was changed by the XI amendment.  Citizens do not refer to illegals that roam onto U.S. soil and do not become naturalized.
----- Original Message -----
From: "MJ" <michaelj@america.net>
To: politicalforum@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 1:14:13 PM
Subject: Re: Tea party antics could end up burning Republicans


This is becoming silly.  Have you actually READ the Constitution?

Occurrences of 'Citizen'

In Article III (describing JURISDICTION for the supreme Court):

  between a State and Citizens of another State; -- between Citizens
  of different States; -- between Citizens of the same State claiming Lands
  under Grants of different States, and between a State, or the Citizens
  thereof, and foreign States, Citizens or Subjects.
In Article IV (ensuring reciprocity between States):

  The Citizens of each State shall be entitled to all Privileges
  and Immunities of Citizens in the several States.
Amendment XI (more jurisdiction):

  The Judicial power of the United States shall not be construed to extend to
  any suit in law or equity, commenced or prosecuted against one of the United
  States by Citizens of another State, or by Citizens or Subjects of any
  Foreign State.
Dubiously Ratified Amendment XIV (aiding Lincoln's illusion):

  All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and
  subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and
  of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law
  which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United
  States;
Amendment XV (preventing voting disqualification by group):

  The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be
  denied or abridged by the United States or by any State on account of
  race, color, or previous condition of servitude.
Amendment XIX (preventing voting disqualification by group)"

  The right of citizens of the United States to vote shall not be denied or
  abridged by the United States or by any State on account of sex.
Amendment XIV (preventing voting disqualification by group):

  The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any
  primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for
  President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in
  Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any
  State by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax.
Amendment XXVI (preventing voting disqualification by group):

  The right of citizens of the United States, who are eighteen
  years of age or older, to vote shall not be denied or abridged by the
  United States or by any State on account of age.
The Constitution, of course, CREATED and LIMITS the Government it created.


STILL do not know what the Bible has to do with anything.

Regard$,
--MJ

The powers delegated by the proposed Constitution to the federal government are few and defined. Those which are to remain in the State governments are numerous and indefinite. The former will be exercised principally on external objects, as war, peace, negotiation, and foreign commerce; with which last the power of taxation will, for the most part, be connected. The powers reserved to the several States will extend to all the objects which, in the ordinary course of affairs, concern the lives, liberties, and properties of the people, and the internal order, improvement, and prosperity of the State. -- James Madison, Federalist Papers



At 12:53 PM 10/29/2010, you wrote:
Look at Romans 1:26-27.  Also the Constitution and the amendments refer to citizens.  Citizens  are all persons born or naturalized in the U.S. and subject to the jurisdiction therein. Clearly it does not apply to illegals.
----- Original Message -----
From: "MJ" <michaelj@america.net>
To: politicalforum@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 12:01:43 PM
Subject: Re: Tea party antics could end up burning Republicans

THIS does not answer the request.
Someone will need to explain this silliness about 'legal' and 'illegal' immigrants.  The US Constitution provides no power whatsoever for the Feds to extend or withhold permission for entry (or exit) into any of the Sovereign States.  Besides, 'migration' is a natural right.
Additionally, rights are inherent in Man's being -- not permissions as you imply.
Not certain WHAT the Bible may have to do with anything.
As an aside, do you have any problem/difficulty with the THEFT and SLAVERY promoted by both the Ds and Rs?

Regard$,
--MJ
"Under the law of nature, all men are born free, every one comes into the world with a right to his own person, which includes the liberty of moving and using it at his own will.  This is what is called personal liberty, and is given him by the Author of nature, because necessary for his own sustenance." --Thomas Jefferson

At 11:42 AM 10/29/2010, you wrote:
What rights do immigrants have unless they are legal?  In reference to the Bible have you read the verses on homosexuality?




----- Original Message -----
From: "MJ" <michaelj@america.net>
To: politicalforum@googlegroups.com
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 11:24:30 AM
Subject: Re: Tea party antics could end up burning Republicans
Can you POINT me to a 'platform' or similar that suggests such?
Thanks in advance.
Regard$,
--MJ
"Any man can make mistakes, but only an idiot persists in his error.
" -- Marcus Tullius Cicero

At 09:18 AM 10/29/2010, you wrote:
>But it seems obvious that the biggest reason to vote Democrat is to
>take one good look at the crazies in the Grand Opressive Tea Party and
>what they will do to oppresss LGBT people, as well as a whole slew of
>demographic minority groups, including immigrants, Latinos,
>African-Americans and women who have been raped or victims of incest.
>If you don't vote for the Democrats, you are opening the door for
>bigoted hateful theocrats like the Fred Phelps Wesboro "Church" who
>totally ignore Jesus' actual message of love, acceptance and inclusion
>and fail to know what their Bible really says.
>The Republican Agenda is anti-American. Their number one priority is
>to obstruct and make The President of The United States fail. Welcome
>to the Recorporate Party of Greed.
>
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