So you are saying that the VA is not government run health insurance?
How about Medicare and Medicaid?
SSI Disability, etc?
Try again, Markie.
On 1/25/11, THE ANNOINTED ONE <markmkahle@gmail.com> wrote:
> Tommy,
>
> Since the Merchant Marine was then, is now and will always be part of
> the fleet reserve forces for the US Military (Navy) of course they and
> the US Navy (also covered under the law you quote) had to carry
> insurance and treat the wounded.
>
> The law covered ALL US flagged ships... and unlike the socialistic
> programs you attempt to compare it to was the fore runner of the VA/
> Military Hospital system.
>
> Try again.
>
> On Jan 24, 9:47 pm, Tommy News <tommysn...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Congress Passes Socialized Medicine and Mandates Health Insurance -In 1798
>>
>> The ink was barely dry on the PPACA when the first of many lawsuits to
>> block the mandated health insurance provisions of the law was filed in
>> a Florida District Court.
>>
>> The pleadings, in part, read -
>>
>> The Constitution nowhere authorizes the United States to mandate,
>> either directly or under threat of penalty, that all citizens and
>> legal residents have qualifying health care coverage.
>>
>> State of Florida, et al. vs. HHS
>>
>> It turns out, the Founding Fathers would beg to disagree.
>>
>> In July of 1798, Congress passed – and President John Adams signed -
>> "An Act for the Relief of Sick and Disabled Seamen." The law
>> authorized the creation of a government operated marine hospital
>> service and mandated that privately employed sailors be required to
>> purchase health care insurance.
>>
>> Keep in mind that the 5th Congress did not really need to struggle
>> over the intentions of the drafters of the Constitutions in creating
>> this Act as many of its members were the drafters of the Constitution.
>>
>> And when the Bill came to the desk of President John Adams for
>> signature, I think it's safe to assume that the man in that chair had
>> a pretty good grasp on what the framers had in mind.
>>
>> Here's how it happened.
>>
>> During the early years of our union, the nation's leaders realized
>> that foreign trade would be essential to the young country's ability
>> to create a viable economy. To make it work, they relied on the
>> nation's private merchant ships – and the sailors that made them go –
>> to be the instruments of this trade.
>>
>> The problem was that a merchant mariner's job was a difficult and
>> dangerous undertaking in those days. Sailors were constantly hurting
>> themselves, picking up weird tropical diseases, etc.
>>
>> The troublesome reductions in manpower caused by back strains, twisted
>> ankles and strange diseases often left a ship's captain without enough
>> sailors to get underway – a problem both bad for business and a strain
>> on the nation's economy.
>>
>> But those were the days when members of Congress still used their
>> collective heads to solve problems – not create them.
>>
>> Realizing that a healthy maritime workforce was essential to the
>> ability of our private merchant ships to engage in foreign trade,
>> Congress and the President resolved to do something about it.
>>
>> Enter "An Act for The Relief of Sick and Disabled Seamen".
>>
>> I encourage you to read the law as, in those days, legislation was
>> short, to the point and fairly easy to understand.
>>
>> The law did a number of fascinating things.
>>
>> First, it created the Marine Hospital Service, a series of hospitals
>> built and operated by the federal government to treat injured and
>> ailing privately employed sailors. This government provided healthcare
>> service was to be paid for by a mandatory tax on the maritime sailors
>> (a little more than 1% of a sailor's wages), the same to be withheld
>> from a sailor's pay and turned over to the government by the ship's
>> owner. The payment of this tax for health care was not optional. If a
>> sailor wanted to work, he had to pay up.
>>
>> This is pretty much how it works today in the European nations that
>> conduct socialized medical programs for its citizens – although 1% of
>> wages doesn't quite cut it any longer.
>>
>> The law was not only the first time the United States created a
>> socialized medical program (The Marine Hospital Service) but was also
>> the first to mandate that privately employed citizens be legally
>> required to make payments to pay for health care services. Upon
>> passage of the law, ships were no longer permitted to sail in and out
>> of our ports if the health care tax had not been collected by the ship
>> owners and paid over to the government – thus the creation of the
>> first payroll tax in our nation's history.
>>
>> When a sick or injured sailor needed medical assistance, the
>> government would confirm that his payments had been collected and
>> turned over by his employer and would then give the sailor a voucher
>> entitling him to admission to the hospital where he would be treated
>> for whatever ailed him.
>>
>> While a few of the healthcare facilities accepting the government
>> voucher were privately operated, the majority of the treatment was
>> given out at the federal maritime hospitals that were built and
>> operated by the government in the nation's largest ports.
>>
>> As the nation grew and expanded, the system was also expanded to cover
>> sailors working the private vessels sailing the Mississippi and Ohio
>> rivers.
>>
>> The program eventually became the Public Health Service, a government
>> operated health service that exists to this day under the supervision
>> of the Surgeon General.
>>
>> So much for the claim that "The Constitution nowhere authorizes the
>> United States to mandate, either directly or under threat of
>> penalty…."
>>
>> As for Congress' understanding of the limits of the Constitution at
>> the time the Act was passed, it is worth noting that Thomas Jefferson
>> was the President of the Senate during the 5th Congress while Jonathan
>> Dayton, the youngest man to sign the United States Constitution, was
>> the Speaker of the House.
>>
>> While I'm sure a number of readers are scratching their heads in the
>> effort to find the distinction between the circumstances of 1798 and
>> today, I think you'll find it difficult.
>>
>> Yes, the law at that time required only merchant sailors to purchase
>> health care coverage. Thus, one could argue that nobody was forcing
>> anyone to become a merchant sailor and, therefore, they were not
>> required to purchase health care coverage unless they chose to pursue
>> a career at sea.
>>
>> However, this is no different than what we are looking at today.
>>
>> Each of us has the option to turn down employment that would require
>> us to purchase private health insurance under the health care reform
>> law.
>>
>> Would that be practical? Of course not – just as it would have been
>> impractical for a man seeking employment as a merchant sailor in 1798
>> to turn down a job on a ship because he would be required by law to
>> purchase health care coverage.
>>
>> What's more, a constitutional challenge to the legality of mandated
>> health care cannot exist based on the number of people who are
>> required to purchase the coverage – it must necessarily be based on
>> whether any American can be so required.
>>
>> Clearly, the nation's founders serving in the 5th Congress, and there
>> were many of them, believed that mandated health insurance coverage
>> was permitted within the limits established by our Constitution.
>>
>> The moral to the story is that the political right-wing has to stop
>> pretending they have the blessings of the Founding Fathers as their
>> excuse to oppose whatever this president has to offer.
>>
>> History makes it abundantly clear that they do not.
>>
>> UPDATE: January 21- Given the conversation and controversy this piece
>> has engendered, Greg Sargent over at The Washington Post put the piece
>> to the test. You might be interested in what Greg discovered in his
>> article, "Newsflash: Founders favored government run health care."
>>
>> More:http://blogs.forbes.com/rickungar/2011/01/17/congress-passes-socializ...
>>
>> --
>> Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time.
>> Have a great day,
>> Tommy
>
> --
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Together, we can change the world, one mind at a time.
Have a great day,
Tommy
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