Sunday, November 28, 2010

Re: Obama fascism continues DHS Starts Seizing Websites

I agree with both of you Jonathan and Dick.
 
I don't know what was in my post to lead either of you to think that I believe the P2P  software companies are somehow liable or at fault.  My only point is that there are folks out there that are utilizing the software for illicit purposes, and it's a problem.   I posed the question to Bruce, and to you two:  "What is the answer"? 
 
Just as important, I don't even understand how DHS is even involved in this matter, or why.  I damn sure don't agree with them being able to go in and close down anyone's web site, or especially a server, without having some kind of evidentiary hearing to establish that there was cause.
 
If anything, it would seem to me that the owners of copyrighted media should bear some of the burden in protecting their work product.   I understand that this must be difficult, and still be able to have media that can be accessible and being able to disseminate or distribute without too much hassle.
 
I think the one that I downloaded was the one that the guy "Bram"  created there CW....I might get to play around with them this evening, and I will check out the Bit Comet dealie/doo-hickey.
 
Thanks CW!!
 
 
 

 
On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 3:47 PM, Jonathan Ashley <jonathanashleyii@lavabit.com> wrote:
It's not about whether the sites provided an outlet for the theft of materials. It is about due process of law. Did the DHS have court orders to shut down the websites in question? Or, did they just do it?

If they just did without warrants, then we truly do live in a police state.


On 11/27/2010 9:28 AM, Keith In Tampa wrote:
Hey Bruce,
 
I had to go and look up BitTorrent....Actually, it's just a new, improved P2P  file sharing software mechanism, and looks to be pretty legit.   It's free, and has a multitude of uses, all for the good.
 
I do have mixed emotions regarding the use of such software however....There are many individuals and entities that  utilize the software for illicit purposes, and therein lies the problem. How do you stop folks from downloading copyrighted materials?  
 
When Napster first came out, (and actually, in lieu of Napster, I used a software program called, "WinMx" which I thought was better than Napster and a lot of the other P2P programs and sites, because those had malicious softtware, malware and adware configured within the programs)  I was guilty of downloading a number of copyrighted media;  predominately music from the 1970s and 1980s.  
 
Having said that, I don't do it anymore, and it is not the "deterrent" aspect of the huge lawsuits that ASCAP, BMI and others in the recording industry have brought forth,  but instead, utilizing the P2P software to download movies, music and other copyrighted intellectual property is literally stealing.   We are nothing less than a thief if we are downloading copyrighted songs, movies and media that is recently released, "For Sale"  products.   
 
Therein lies the conundrum.....I have no use for DHS, and I don't know why this particular government bureaucracy is involved in this, but again, there has to be some stewardship by some entity to cause the theft to stop!  
 
I'm all ears Bruce, how would you propose that this illicit activity of stealing music and movies be, "Policed"??
 


 
On Sat, Nov 27, 2010 at 11:42 AM, Bruce Majors <majors.bruce@gmail.com> wrote:

ME Dont know whqat to think
 about this ??
TxForce 
***********
 
 
Mike Flynn

Another Homeland Security Overreach:

 DHS Starts Seizing Websites

The always interesting Business Insider has this report:

The Department of Homeland Security's ICE has launched a major crackdown on websites enabling copyright infringement or selling counterfeits of trademarked goods. In just the past few days ICE has seized at least 12 domains, TorrentFreak reports.

All of these domains now display the image shown here.

Okay, so each of the domains seized is probably breaking the law. Knowingly violating someone's copyright is rightfully against the law. I don't know anything about these sites, but, for now, I'll assume they were selling knock-off goods as the real thing and not as some kind of faux Louis Vuitton. Still, this part of the article bothers me:

The owner of an affected site told TorrentFreak that his domain was taken over without any prior complaints or notification from the court.

So, the sites were seized before the site's owner heard any charges or had the chance to submit any counter evidence in court. The owners of the sites had their property seized without being allowed to defend themselves. I successfully avoided law school, so I don't know the exact legal term, but this strikes me as an overstep in their enforcement authority.

But, the article begs an even bigger question: What the hell do fake Guccis have to do with homeland security?

I can appreciate that trafficking in fake goods and music piracy inflict substantial economic harm on the branded companies and labels. But, I do appreciate also that this has nothing to do with protecting the country from foreign or domestic terrorists. We still have a Justice Department, right?

In fact, the article notes that Congress hasn't given this authority to the Attorney General:

A controversial bill that would allow the Attorney General to shut down domains on similar grounds was recently derailed (temporarily) by Oregon Senator Ron Wyden.

The Attorney General is the chief enforcer of federal law and, accordingly, is responsible for enforcing federal copyright protections. And, he doesn't have the authority that Homeland Security is asserting for itself.

This goes to the heart of why I strongly opposed the creation of DHS when first proposed. Like its contemporaneous legislation, the Patriot Act, it wasn't so much the specifics of the proposal, but what it would eventually evolve into that bothered me.  Bureaucracies may seem to live in their own ecosystem, but they operate largely like any other business, i.e. they try to grow. Unfortunately for us, the way bureaucracies grow is to issue more regulations and assert ever more authority over parts of our life.

In the aftermath of 9-11, when the creation of DHS was being debated, would your opinion have been swayed if you knew that, within just a few years, the proposed agency would be seizing websites peddling fake purses? Did you imagine that the proposed agency would soon demand to take naked photographs of randomly-selected U.S. citizens? Or, insist on its authority to physically grope children?

Now, ask yourself this: What will the Agency be doing 10 years from now? Or, 20? In a little more than half a decade, DHS has morphed from protecting us from terrorists to protecting us from fake merchandise. Who is going to protect us from DHS

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